*** Opened channel log for #ADF at 30/09/2014 7:39:16 PM [19:41] *** ThornUnderleaf (Mibbit@14055a38.14055a96.50.121.imsk) has joined #ADF [19:41] Hello :) [19:42] I hope I'm not too early, but I showed up way late last time and wanted to make sure I didn't miss out. [19:43] [Owlhawk] welcome. there is no such thing as too early around here so long as you are ready for us to be distracted by our internet browsers.... [19:45] *** SaraKBlackwelder (Mibbit@6e188568.tampfl.fios.36f5c1fe.net.hmsk) has joined #ADF [19:45] [Owlhawk] Hi! [19:46] hello! [19:46] Hello [19:46] how's everyone tonight? [19:46] [Owlhawk] Shopping is done, bills are paid...it's time for a beer. [19:47] woot! [19:47] A pagan we know is coming tomorrow to get all the scrap metal and plastics he can recycle [19:47] [Owlhawk] awesome. I'm disposing of a shed worth of scrap metal this week. [19:48] nice! [19:48] [Owlhawk] it collapsed at the beginning of april and I replaced it this weekend. [19:48] We have been taking it to the U U church for their recycling but this means we don't have to do anything and it helps a person who needs help right now [19:49] Hello THorn [19:50] I know I am a little slow tonight [19:55] apparently we all are [19:56] At least I am in good company [19:56] :) [19:57] [Owlhawk] :D [19:58] *** RobHenderson (Mibbit@5a79652d.hsd1.mi.5aa6454b.net.hmsk) has joined #ADF [19:59] Hi all! [19:59] Hello Rob [19:59] hi Rob [20:00] [Owlhawk] HEllo [20:02] *** Javid (Mibbit@a05afb79.wi.res.14056255.com.hmsk) has joined #ADF [20:04] Hello Javid [20:06] *** Auberon (Mibbit@59e8fc9f.nwrknj.fios.36f5c1fe.net.hmsk) has joined #ADF [20:06] Hey! This is my first time in here. Is this just solitaries or more of a general chat? [20:06] Does anyone have anything that they to talk about? [20:06] Hello room [20:06] Hello Auberon [20:06] I'm up for anything, hello to you too Rovena. [20:07] [Owlhawk] More of a general chat. Although all questions are welcome [20:07] Tuesdays are open to everyone [20:07] Nothing on my mind right now. [20:07] Howdy Rob. [20:07] I'm working on my DP right now. [20:07] *** Dale_ (guest@da0a743d.new.res.14056255.com.hmsk) has joined #ADF [20:08] Good evening [20:08] Evening Dale [20:08] Hello Dale [20:08] Hi Auberon. Hi Rovena [20:09] sorry, I got called away. I'm back now. Good evening, everyone. [20:09] Good evening Thorn [20:09] We will forgive you ... this time [20:09] (cue ominous music) [20:09] Next time you face.... [20:09] Yeah, I'll try to give you a heads up before I pop out next time. XD [20:09] THE DRUID INQUISITION! [20:09] O_O [20:09] I wasn't expecting that [20:10] No one does ^.^ [20:10] Nobody expects the Druid Inquisition! [20:10] Our sigular weapon is surprise. Surprise and a fanatical loyalty to our ideals... Oh bother... [20:11] And to mead [20:11] and whiskey [20:11] Somebody bring me a shrubbery … oh, sorry … wrong skit. [20:11] NI! [20:11] [Owlhawk] I need more mead.... [20:12] So I've been in a few fights... errr... battles to the death... errr... I mean frank discussions, yes that's what I mean. On how a Druid should druid. [20:12] [Owlhawk] my apologies [20:14] Many folks say I should haul my hide out into the depths of the woods as often as possible and spend as much time in the most "natural" landscapes that I can. I argue that Paganism should be based on where one lives not where they can hike to that is farthest from human habitation. [20:14] Ask five Druids, get ten different answers... [20:14] [Owlhawk] at a minimum.... [20:14] And have fun watching people debate with themselves … aloud. [20:14] Well if everyone would just listen to me we'd be okay ;) [20:15] XD Haha [20:15] That's been my experience in every book I read. [20:15] Well actually we'd probably be screwed [20:15] One of my members is allergic to nature . . literally [20:15] Silly people, thinking an urban landscape isn't a form of nature in itself. [20:15] [Owlhawk] on a serious side, I have found many pagans forget that humans and their cities are themselves part of nature, albeit a changed/modified part. [20:15] Most natural thing there is, a nest. [20:15] Just like a beaver dam, ant colony, bee hive ect. [20:16] That's always been my philosophy. Since when did we become not a part of nature? [20:16] Even this computer I'm typing on is natural. [20:16] Yeap. Not to mention cities are in the long run more eco friendly. [20:16] [Owlhawk] uhmmm...that I would have to see evidence for [20:16] Our ancestors struggled with generations to be less dependant on the fickle nature of nature. Why undo all they strived for…though adding more conciousness of nature into our modern lives is worthwhile. [20:18] Well Owlhawk I offer a few ideas on that to chew on. Here in the urban areas I can bike or take public transportation, or if I use a car I must refill it once a week. In the rural south I was raised in I had to drive almost everywhere and needed to refill at least three times a week. [20:18] There is the fact that if we screw over Nature then we are screwed [20:18] That's the first. The second image if we had everyone living in the cities scatter out across nature well we'd end up needing to cut down and clear a lot more forests. [20:18] [Owlhawk] I live in a city and I fill my car once a month... [20:19] Oh nice, better millage but you see my driving point. [20:19] [Owlhawk] No, it's misleading. When I journey into Toronto, nearest large city, my gas mileage doubles or triples. [20:20] not in my experience [20:20] [Owlhawk] And my car gets 40 miles to the gallon [20:20] *** ErinP (Mibbit@6ca5ecc1.14055ad5.70.51.imsk) has joined #ADF [20:20] I fill up once a week, though I drive nearly 300 miles to and from work each week. If I didn’t get 30mpg, I would be hurting. [20:20] Hi! [20:20] Hello Erin [20:20] Hi Erin [20:20] [Owlhawk] Hello, how are you Erin? [20:20] Hi there, Erin [20:21] Hi Erin! [20:21] Distributing power and heating resources is easier and more efficient in a city than in the suburbs, certainly. [20:21] I'm pretty good ty. Hi owlhawk, thorn, auberon [20:21] Trying to find it now there where a few good articles on this, one day I really need to save this and indeed Rob. [20:22] Anyone get oakleaves regularly? [20:22] *** Thexalon (Mibbit@b07a5574.neo.res.14056255.com.hmsk) has joined #ADF [20:23] MinutePhysics/MinuteEarth did a nice short video about that on youtube. How cities are more efficient when you build up instead of outwards. [20:23] i do [20:23] Hello Thexalon [20:23] Howdy, folks! [20:23] Oh yes I am a fan of verticle farms [20:23] Literally turn a sky scraper into an indoor farm. [20:23] Hydroponics? [20:23] Cause I got it for a year cause I submitted an article but I haven't seen it there yet [20:23] Hi thexalon [20:24] something like that as fas I understand [20:24] I can't afford OL, sadly. [20:24] the other thing is as it is indoors can grow year around AND no need for pesticides. [20:24] :( [20:24] email the editors and ask about it [20:24] [Owlhawk] I can't either to be honest, but my wife insists that I should find the room in the budget for it. so I juggle a lot... [20:25] [Owlhawk] I do Erin...why? [20:25] Owlhawk : I got a new bf! [20:25] [Owlhawk] :D [20:25] my finaces have been improving lately. [20:25] Congrads Erin. [20:25] [Owlhawk] do I know him? [20:25] No, he's from Brockville... Comes to see me on weekends [20:26] He's pagan friendly. He came to our automne équinoxes rit [20:26] [Owlhawk] As far as the article goes, they are used for the magazine as the editor in chief needs them to fill each magazine. Some articles are held back for the next edition. [20:26] [Owlhawk] awesome [20:27] He "doesn't do church" lol [20:27] [Owlhawk] that means you have to bring him to KG [20:27] I know the article I sent in was published nine months later. [20:27] He's great [20:27] Thinking of writing something for oakleaves [20:27] Yes I told him. About that. [20:27] Buuuut my views are not really ADF mainstream lol [20:27] [Owlhawk] I encourage you to do so. We need the articles [20:27] Nobody's are, Auberon. [20:28] I had some wanting to run me outa ADF for my views on Earth Mother. [20:28] I doubt if mine will make it in [20:28] [Owlhawk] I'm one of the Editors for Oakleaves and my views aren't mainstream... [20:28] I'm an ADF Priest and I don't think we should have to honor the Earth Mother at every rite. How much further from our mainstream can you get? >8) [20:28] [Owlhawk] lol [20:29] You are in my boat then Rob if she does get honored it's with the rest of the gods and goddesses. [20:29] Never let anyone scare you away from being here. [20:29] [Owlhawk] Erin, your article is thought provoking and is a story that is awe inspring [20:29] Ya well It didbt make it into the last issue [20:30] Regardless, if you've written something, better to send it in than not. I don't mind a little bit of provocation and disagreement. [20:30] [Owlhawk] neither did mine.... [20:31] Can one buy back issues? Cause I kinda want the one with my article in it :p [20:32] [Owlhawk] Yes you can, through the store. [20:32] I think so, and many are available as PDFs on the web site. [20:32] Ok [20:33] And as far as honoring the Earth Mother goes, I see that as honoring our RDNA roots, making Wiccans amongst us happy, even though it's not really a reconstructionist thing to do. [20:33] [Owlhawk] I actually don't mind that one as we should be honouring the one upon whom we live [20:33] I don't see the point of Hallowing the waters [20:34] I heard a rumor that it was going to become optional [20:34] As you can guess, I don't care what RDNA or Wiccans think of us. >8) [20:35] I've seen that debate come up a few times, I think it would be a good idea. I think it is gonna happen sooner or later. [20:35] And as I love to say if I wanted to worship like a Wiccan I'd be a Wiccan ^.^ [20:36] Trust me, I wouldn't make a big fuss if someone skipped over that part, I just see it more as a recent-ancestor thing rather than an ancient-ancestor thing. [20:36] My Grove usually doesn't do the waters, so I'm pretty sure it's already optional. [20:36] If not, I may have to resign. >8) [20:37] Ee do ask for blessings and distribute them, but usually in another form, like cider or bread. [20:37] That's fine - the point of that is pretty clearly to get some sort of tangible something as a blessing in return for the sacrifices. [20:38] I toss a penny into my well and say an invocation (evocation) poof water is blssed does that count? [20:38] And obviously we can't do the traditional "We get the meat, gods get the skin-and-bones" routine. [20:38] [Owlhawk] lol [20:38] My senior druid thinks it's kinda arrogant to ask a blessing for a blessing [20:38] Well maybe some day. >8) [20:39] Um, does your senior druid know what *ghosti- means? [20:39] Well that is ghosti and it is a key element of Indo-European worship. [20:39] Dunno. [20:39] "Gift for a gift" was far more integral to ancient IE religions than Earth Mother worship was. [20:40] We bless them, they bless us. I really am not to found of this strain of thought that it is arogant of us to ask the gods for stuff. [20:40] Fun fact, there may never have been an actual goddess Danu. [20:40] I heard that! [20:40] Hey, not my thought [20:40] I thought that it was arrogant when I was fresh out of my xtian days......but I understand the concept a bit better now...as it's not about demanding something, it's about building a relationship [20:41] Gebo - The exchange of gifts. [20:41] I'd ask him what kind of relationship with the Kindreds he thinks is more appropriate, then. [20:41] It's not a he [20:41] Oops, my bad. [20:41] It's a she [20:42] Somehow I thought you'd said he. Blame my eyesight. [20:42] Np [20:42] Usually people that keep saying it's arrogant or selfish to ask the gods for stuff I tell them to live by St. Francis rule or drop it, well actually I say something a bit stronger. [20:42] Anyhow, food for thought. My eyes are going too, so I shall te [20:42] The Greek concept of kharis is all about being blessed by the gods because of your right relations with them. (And I didn't know until this week, is the origin of our word "charisma".) [20:43] Retire [20:43] see ya Erin [20:43] Fair enough, seeya! [20:43] night Erin [20:43] Night guys, girls! [20:43] Toodeloo [20:43] Good night [20:43] I have noticed when I attend to my offerings my life goes better. Says a lot about me I slack so often. [20:43] *** ErinP (Mibbit@6ca5ecc1.14055ad5.70.51.imsk) has quit IRC [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] [20:43] [Owlhawk] good night Erin. Kayley says it as well [20:44] And the funny thing is that the Greeks at least have a very explicit and well-documented Earth Mother figure. [20:44] But not really worshipped [20:44] Some hearths did and some didn't. [20:44] SO it would be more appropriate for some than for others [20:45] She had one holiday in Athens, I'll give her that. [20:46] that's more then I've found and even though in Solitary Druid (and other ADF sources) there is talking about founding the local land or river goddess, in my research the local spirits where just as likely to be male, as female. Or even both genders or no gender. [20:48] The local spirits are generally seen as of a different sort than the cosmic deities, though. [20:48] [Owlhawk] Gaea and Demeter were well worshipped in ancient Greece. We honour them now with our worship. Thexalon is saying that Gaea is likely the most documented Earth Mother Goddess we have in IE myth. [20:48] My Grove works with our local river goddess. [20:48] Because of gender issues, we call upon a Earth Spirit rather than the Earth Mother [20:48] Well, I don't know about "The most documented", but certainly well-documented. [20:48] I mean local spirits Thexalon [20:49] *** Drum (Mibbit@14055acf.6ca5ecde.73.161.imsk) has joined #ADF [20:49] [Owlhawk] Hi Drum [20:49] *** Mode change [+o Drum] on #ADF by ChanServ [20:49] Hi Drum! [20:49] Hello Drum [20:49] Hello, Sara [20:49] Hey, Drum [20:49] [Owlhawk] I can't think of a more documented Earth Goddess Thexalon... [20:49] Hello, Dale [20:49] It is something that stuck me as interesting when I looked into some local mythologies of places I know and heard stories that the river diety was a god. The debates over that oh boy lol [20:50] Hello, Thorn [20:50] Hiya Drum [20:50] It's just I love how inspite of our efforts nothing wants to fit into a nice little box. [20:50] I don't think of gender so rigidly that a deity can't be one or the other or both or neither. [20:50] Well, of course. [20:51] Nature spirits in particular can be like that, Auberon. [20:51] *** SeanHarbaugh (Mibbit@14055a91.6ca5ed20.99.30.imsk) has joined #ADF [20:51] Hello Sean [20:51] [Owlhawk] hello sean! [20:51] Good evening! [20:51] Sean! [20:51] Hello, Auberon :) [20:51] Hi Sean [20:52] See my point above Rob or just to save you time I'll retype it here for you: in my research the local spirits where just as likely to be male as female or even both genders or no gender. [20:52] Hi, Sean [20:52] *waves* [20:52] Right, that's what I was commenting on. [20:53] Sorry if that comes off as mean spirited Rob. One of my biggest buttons in RL is people telling me somethin I literally just stated. It happens about three times a week at work. [20:53] Hi Sean and Drum! [20:53] I try not to think of deities as male or female, but rather 'complements' to each other. Try to at least. [20:53] I'll look at co-workers and go, I literally just said that, almost word for word. [20:53] Ennh. I didn't read it as mean. (I seldom do.) [20:53] wow. what I did I just walk into? [20:53] Hello Rob [20:54] Sean, Murphy's Law [20:54] Sean: I'm leading a revolt against EM worship in ADF, so the usual. [20:54] ah [20:54] And I've been leading one also and am joining ranks with Rob. [20:54] you're on the wrong end of that argument with me brother. [20:54] "ditto" [20:54] just saying ;) [20:55] I've noticed in my few talks that Robs view is more in line with younger members and younger pagans in general. [20:55] I described it as a recent-ancestor practice, not an ancient-ancestor practice, but that isn't enough to get rid of it. [20:55] Make it optional and the problem solves itself [20:55] However we want to call it, I just know what it is for me, and for me it is meaningful and important in my work. :) [20:55] Worship of goddesses of sovereignty is very IE, so for me I'm not sure why we have this argument. [20:56] [Owlhawk] It ferments thought in those who participate [20:56] because not everyone did it every rite. Seriosuly look it up. [20:56] (Aww, he thinks I'm young!) [20:56] [Owlhawk] lol\ [20:56] Hehe [20:56] So make it optional those that like it can do it, those that don't wont. [20:57] ok. But ADF is a neopagan tradition based on what the ancients did, and it is something that makes us who we are. [20:57] Sovereignity goddess worship I'm down with, I just don't get making it on a planetary level. [20:57] We're not strict reconstructionist. I like to call us reformed reformed druids for a reason. [20:57] Sean, Do you consider any Sovereignty goddess to be an/the Earth Mother? [20:57] Rob, you don't have to. [20:57] As I literally just typed Sean, not everyone back then worshipped her and she wasn't worshipped in each and every rite. [20:57] Some of our literature and many of our members think otherwise, Sean. [20:58] In Gaelic lore, goddesses of sovereignty were protectors of the land. Even aspects of the Morrighan can be seen as Eather Motherish. [20:58] and a growing number at that [20:58] But not ever ADFer is Gaelic [20:58] and again optional [20:58] Earth Mother does not necessarily equate to sovereignty goddess. [20:59] [Owlhawk] quite a few here are not... [20:59] I agree about the Morrigu and Earth Motherish at times, Sean [20:59] I'm thinking thay further comment may become inflammatory, plus Agents of SHIELD is on, so I should go. [20:59] Oh come on Rob stay and say it [20:59] I'll see you in three days Rob. [20:59] I am dying to read that article you keep wanting to write [20:59] You can do both [20:59] [Owlhawk] good night Rob. [20:59] Or four days if I get my ride from Fox. >8) [20:59] lol [21:00] lol I will just say that only one thing with the Earth Mother camp worries me, infact it right now disturbs and frightens me a little. [21:00] you'll see me. remember, I rarely sleep. [21:00] Same here [21:00] Before i go: My argument is against the planetary goddess that many of our leaders *cough*Ian*cough* and other members seem to insist upon. [21:01] SWL!!! [21:01] see ya later Rob [21:01] SWL? [21:01] Night, Rob [21:01] And I'd rather see it made optional for people who want their rites to be more recon. [21:01] [Owlhawk] ??? DRUM [21:01] Yes, I was screaming with laughter at Rob's coughing fit [21:01] I'm not a robot, and neither are you. In other words, you can view her as you want. Ian is welcome to his views. [21:01] [Owlhawk] ah [21:01] lol [21:01] I have an Earth Mother cough drop that could cure that cough, just saying [21:02] Then I honestly think we should make that more clear to the membership, Sean. [21:02] Also, for the record, I'm not Ian, even though I'm one of his grovies. [21:02] I swear a robot called me tonight.....it was even trying to say it was a real person!! [21:02] Is it horehound? I love horehound cough drops. [21:02] I've been told it is totally NOT optional. As I said I've had people tell me to leave over this. [21:02] I had one call me too. It's election season. [21:02] If you are performing COoR, then it is not. [21:02] It is Slippery Elm, Rob [21:03] Anyway, Phil Coulson is on the telly. Night! [21:03] night Rob [21:03] nini [21:03] Night [21:03] Night, Rob. See you on Friday! [21:03] [Owlhawk] good night [21:03] not optional. In private practice, you can do what you want. There is no ADF ritual police. [21:03] *** RobHenderson (Mibbit@5a79652d.hsd1.mi.5aa6454b.net.hmsk) has quit IRC [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] [21:03] night Rob [21:04] I am so behind on my DP [21:04] Nobody expects the ADF inquisition! Our chief weapons are hugs, surprise, ruthless inefficiency, and nice white uniforms ... [21:04] [Owlhawk] oh? [21:04] [Owlhawk] And Mead! [21:05] hmmm hugs I could use [21:05] especially from a cute, young, single druidess [21:05] Don't forget the comfy chair, Thexalon! [21:05] Welp, I was there until you said "single", Auberon XD [21:05] [Owlhawk] I thought I was behind on my DP and then I finished about 3/4 of it in a month and half. don't panic, it's easier then you fear [21:06] lol yeah trying to find a Pagan GF is.... difficult [21:07] but yeah been at the DP since 09 [21:07] [Owlhawk] whatt part are you finding difficult? [21:08] honeslty I got discouraged after what happened with a friend of mine. During this time she kept submitting it only to find the requirements had changed. It got brought up on the list and one person commented they should challenge themselves to do the newer material. [21:08] Then when I had a guid she sent my stuff back saying it needed sources from non-European religions. [21:09] I just sorta went... What's the point and never been able to summon the energy to work on it since. [21:09] [Owlhawk] a guid? [21:09] dp guide, tutor whatever there called now heh [21:10] this was all years ago mind and that friend has since passed it. [21:10] Well Auberon, you can always ask questions about the DP here [21:10] [Owlhawk] umm...I had no sources form non european religions for mine and I passed... [21:10] the DP does not require sources. [21:11] yeah I wished I'd saved the emails to turn over about that I was told that was irregular when I finally asked about it. [21:11] Yeah, I read through the requirements recently and I don't remember it saying anything about non-Europen religions being required. [21:11] The other thing I was told is it was too urban focused, nevermind I live in an urban area and was literally writing about the enviroment I live in. [21:11] I passed my DP using only European religions. I'm not sure what this guide was drawing from. [21:11] [Owlhawk] it's bizarre. but feel free to ask us about the DP we answer questions on it fairly well, and occasionally have people who mark it floating around... [21:12] aye but like I said after all that it's just hard trying to get the motivation. [21:13] [Owlhawk] that is up to you. [21:13] trying to, of course I'm also working on my spelling, grammar, Japanese and math [21:13] Having been a DP reviewer and mentor for as far back as I can remember, this seems extremely odd. [21:14] yeap I've been told [21:14] Well, that shouldn't happen any more [21:15] yeap now just gotta get my butt in gear [21:16] [Owlhawk] that we can't help you with.... [21:17] A mentor might be able to help [21:18] or a personal nagger .. er, study buddy [21:18] lol [21:18] XD [21:18] of course outside of that for me trying to work throught the virtues usin MJD's guide has been... interesting [21:18] Who said you had to use MJD's guide? [21:19] [Owlhawk] If you need some one to proof read it for you, I could take a look. [21:19] I bring that up just so everypony here knows I tried to use it [21:19] and my brony just came out lol [21:20] But when I try to look up definition of the virtues using other sources I am left scratching my head [21:20] [Owlhawk] I read MJD's guide....I did not use it [21:21] What hearth culture are you drawing from the most? [21:21] Welsh mostly [21:21] with the virtues I am currently stuck on Vision [21:22] Is there any episode in the Mabinogi that seems like it would be relevant? [21:22] I've tried to look it up and all I find is imagination i.e. day dreaming or the sense of sight [21:22] and I am going how is this a virtue? [21:23] is there something I am missing? [21:23] or maybe vision is about seeing how things could be [21:24] In other words, the virtue of vision is not the same as having visions. [21:24] I think of vision as inspiration--of having goals. [21:24] so using your imagination? [21:24] *** Javid (Mibbit@a05afb79.wi.res.14056255.com.hmsk) has quit IRC [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] [21:24] okay that makes a bit more sense Sean [21:25] being inspired to be excellent. [21:25] how to shape your actions to achieve goals [21:25] seeing how [21:25] Imagination, but in a productive sense, unlike daydreaming, which usually isn’t productive [21:26] makes more sense now [21:26] Your eyes see what is and vision sees what could be [21:26] from the definitions and some of what I read it it just seemed like day dreaming [21:26] [Owlhawk] vision is seeing. here, and into the future. [21:26] not planning [21:27] oh, it can include planning. [21:27] [Owlhawk] almost has to... [21:28] well failing to plan is planning to fail. [21:28] It's more about figuring out the goals of planning. [21:29] ok [21:32] ok, goodnight all! [21:33] Good night [21:33] [Owlhawk] here's a link to how I defined it for my DP. Maybe it will help you Auberon. http://owl-hawk.livejournal.com/2011/05/02/ [21:33] I'm out too. Good night everyone. [21:33] [Owlhawk] good night Sara and Sean [21:33] *** SaraKBlackwelder (Mibbit@6e188568.tampfl.fios.36f5c1fe.net.hmsk) has quit IRC [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] [21:33] *** SeanHarbaugh (Mibbit@14055a91.6ca5ed20.99.30.imsk) has quit IRC [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] [21:33] Thanks ^.^ [21:33] I am vanishing too. It was nice seeing you all! [21:33] Night [21:33] Night, Drum [21:34] :) [21:34] Good night [21:34] Nightg [21:34] *** Drum (Mibbit@14055acf.6ca5ecde.73.161.imsk) has quit IRC [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] [21:34] [Owlhawk] good night Sean [21:36] I should be going too, actually [21:36] [Owlhawk] good night [21:37] Good night [21:37] Good night, everyone. It was nice meeting you all ^-^ Good luck with the DP, Auberon! [21:37] The mass exodus begins [21:37] *** ThornUnderleaf (Mibbit@14055a38.14055a96.50.121.imsk) has quit IRC [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] [21:37] [Owlhawk] yup [21:37] This is weird, Normally I am the one that starts this [21:38] Thanks ^.^ sorry reading lol [21:38] I'm not completely gone! [21:39] [Owlhawk] I'm normally the one that ends it... [21:39] I have tomorrow off so I get to stay up later than normal [21:39] [Owlhawk] My blog isn't that interesting Auberon... [21:39] [Owlhawk] good night Rovena [21:40] Any suggestions on the Two Powers essay? That one is giving me a bit of grief. [21:40] [Owlhawk] the two powers is essentially a Tree of life meditation. [21:40] [Owlhawk] That is what is based on. [21:41] [Owlhawk] What about it is causing you issues? [21:42] I think it’s the idea of grounding and centering, which I don’t quite get….that’s not quite it, but in general, I don’t see it any different than just mindfullness meditation…stilling and focusing the mind. [21:43] But what do you focus your mind on? That's what makes it a Two Powers meditation, not just any random meditation. [21:43] There’s the concept that one can drain off excess energy, and redistribute it through the body, however, I’ve never really experienced that. [21:43] [Owlhawk] grounding is connecting to the earth energies and allowing them to flow into and out of you. [21:44] [Owlhawk] I have a bit of trouble explaining centering.... [21:44] Up are pulling up the earth energies and pulling down the sky energies then blancing them [21:44] I’ve done the Two Powers meditation quite a bit, but haven’t really noticed anything to write about, as far as my experiences with it go. [21:45] [Owlhawk] once you have grounded then centering is part of the process. The energy flows through you to the heavens and from the heavens to the earth. During that process youwill notice a part of you that stays the same, usually around your solar plexus. the energy flows in and out of it. [21:46] [Owlhawk] in both directions. I explain this better in person..... [21:46] Rovena, yes, but is there more than than the imagry? I also don’t visualize in guided meditations…which is a challenge of its own :) [21:47] You don't have to use visual imagery if other sorts work better for you. I not infrequently feel cold in my feet as the waters come up from the ground, for example. [21:48] Also (and I'll admit this is heavily Ian-influenced) think more water below, fire above, than earth versus sky. [21:48] FOr me, it is more than imagery. [21:48] [Owlhawk] lol [21:48] Owlhawk, I get the theory, but don’t know that I have ever really experieinced it in practice…Or haven’t recognized it. [21:49] [Owlhawk] I can't think water above, as that is where Air is... [21:49] :) [21:49] [Owlhawk] Then keep practicing. [21:49] I didn't say water above, I said fire above. Which is exactly where that Aristotle guy put it. [21:50] [Owlhawk] Sorry. misread [21:50] [Owlhawk] I seem to remember reading about him...and some Plato guy... [21:50] [Owlhawk] good night [21:51] Good night [21:51] [Owlhawk] oops..mistype [21:56] Last one out, please turn off the lights and lock the door. [21:56] *** Rovena (rovena@14055b31.6ca5ec7e.174.33.imsk) has left #ADF [21:59] Well, I don't have the key, so I guess I'm out. [21:59] *** Thexalon (Mibbit@b07a5574.neo.res.14056255.com.hmsk) has quit IRC [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] [21:59] [Owlhawk] meh... [22:00] If I invert the colors on my monitor, it almost looks like someone turned off the lights, and the night light went on. [22:00] [Owlhawk] good thought [22:00] *** Auberon (Mibbit@59e8fc9f.nwrknj.fios.36f5c1fe.net.hmsk) has quit IRC [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] [22:01] I should get to writing. Have a good evening :) [22:01] [Owlhawk] good night [22:01] … get back to ... [22:01] *** Dale_ (guest@da0a743d.new.res.14056255.com.hmsk) has quit IRC [Quit: Dale_] *** Closed channel log for #ADF at 30/09/2014 10:10:34 PM