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[19:46] <Rovenamarie> Hello Texalon
[19:46] <Thexalon> Howdy, folks. Figured I'd pop in.
[19:47] <Rovenamarie> Great.
[19:49] <Rovenamarie> How are you tonight?
[19:50] [Owlhawk] hello
[19:50] <Rovenamarie> Hello Owlhawk
[19:52] <Thexalon> I'll be showing up, then dashing off for a bit, then back, while I prepare my home for the first maternal visit I've had in many years.
[19:52] <Rovenamarie> Do what you need.  Maternal visits are important
[19:53] [Owlhawk] My mom has given up on me meeting her expectations for the home. She's happy to get smoked bbq ribs now.
[19:54] <Rovenamarie> What not mead?
[19:55] [Owlhawk] she doesn't like it. too sweet for her.
[19:56] <Rovenamarie> Oh, well, more for you and the wife.
[19:57] [Owlhawk] that's how we see it. My brother on the other hand, will take as much as I give him.
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[20:02] <Thexalon> Hi KayjaAthena
[20:02] <KayjaAthena> hi
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[20:03] <Rovenamarie> Hello KayaAthena
[20:03] <Rovenamarie> Hello Lesley
[20:03] <Lesley> hey beautiful people
[20:03] [Owlhawk] hello
[20:04] <Lesley> how are yall
[20:04] <Rovenamarie> trying to be beautiful
[20:04] <Lesley> you are beautiful!
[20:04] <KayjaAthena> hi all
[20:05] <KayjaAthena> Beautiful? I'm just trying to stay awake. LOL!
[20:06] <Rovenamarie> I hear ya
[20:06] <Lesley> I am wired tonight but could be cause I had a busy great day
[20:07] <Rovenamarie> That can do it
[20:07] [Owlhawk] I argued with a printer all afternoon. I'm not sure there is now enough booze in the house....
[20:07] <KayjaAthena> LOL!
[20:08] <KayjaAthena> I had the most frustrating dream last night. Left me feeling like I hadn't slept. UGH!
[20:08] <Lesley> oh man hope you are alright and tonight find rest
[20:08] <Lesley> did you write it out
[20:08] [Owlhawk] And once I got the stupid wireless canon piece of shit installed and working, it won't print properly a document, a coupon, from inside a web broswer....I suspect she will be returning the piece of crap and buying something worth paying for
[20:09] <KayjaAthena> Yes, i wrote it down. Not that I needed to. it would be hard to forget.
[20:09] <Lesley> oh man I hate canon
[20:09] <Lesley> hope you get help soon
[20:09] [Owlhawk] yup. nothing but garbage
[20:09] <Thexalon> Arguing with a printer is never worthwhile - no matter what you do, you won't convince it to like you.
[20:09] <KayjaAthena> Awww! poor Owlhawk. Printer having an attitude huh?
[20:10] [Owlhawk] I charge 30 an hour to argue with a printer....
[20:10] <KayjaAthena> LOL!
[20:10] [Owlhawk] I just hate crap tech 
[20:11] <KayjaAthena> my printer knows better. if it has an attitude, I refuse to use it for days or weeks. It doesn't like that. :D
[20:12] <Lesley> my printer always works for me, but some how my mom always gets it offline, I laugh and fix it over and over again
[20:12] <Lesley> I don't know what she does
[20:13] <Lesley> brb getting some dinner before company comes over
[20:13] <KayjaAthena> ok
[20:14] <Thexalon> So, were we planning on discussing something druidry-related?
[20:14] <Rovenamarie> What would you like to discuss?
[20:15] <KayjaAthena> anything
[20:17] <Rovenamarie> Someone throw a topic out there and we will chew on it awhile
[20:17] [Owlhawk] Anyone working on there DP?
[20:17] <KayjaAthena> me
[20:17] <KayjaAthena> just started
[20:18] <Rovenamarie> I hope to finish soonish
[20:18] <Thexalon> KayjaAthena, any challenges you're running into that you'd like help on?
[20:20] <KayjaAthena> not yet. I just started reading the manual a few days ago. still gathering up things I need to delve into it all.
[20:21] <Thexalon> If it helps, the minimum set of stuff you need to get started is: 1 bowl of water, 1 stick, and 1 candle.
[20:21] [Owlhawk] Rovena, any areas you need help with?
[20:22] [Owlhawk] And a cup of drink .
[20:22] <Rovenamarie> Time
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[20:22] <KayjaAthena> Got that already.
[20:22] [Owlhawk] sorry, I don't bend time anymore
[20:22] <KayjaAthena> LOL
[20:22] [Owlhawk] TARDIS went on strike, won't negotiate.
[20:23] <Thexalon> Oh yes, and a drink. The point is, get started on it, don't worry about whether or not you have the perfect-looking altar.
[20:23] <KayjaAthena> Just what I was thinking. :O
[20:23] <Rovenamarie> Between three chats, weekly yoga, doing lessons for the protogrove, and a column for the ACentral Region newsletter, I have trouble getting to work much less do the DP
[20:23] <KayjaAthena> have an altar already too
[20:23] [Owlhawk] ouch
[20:23] <KayjaAthena> Sounds kinda like me Rovena
[20:24] [Owlhawk] Altar is great. It took me 15 years or so to set up an altar, so you're moving faster then I did on that part.
[20:24] <Rovenamarie> Maybe if I had gotten a mentor I might have staned on tract better
[20:24] <KayjaAthena> Doing DP, doing genealogy, sewing and cross-stitich porjects galore
[20:25] <KayjaAthena> on top of making sure kids get to school and do homework. LOL
[20:26] <KayjaAthena> My altar is still a work in progress, Owlhawk. But at least I have something.
[20:26] <Thexalon> Ian Corrigan's altar is still a work in progress too! You're never really done with it.
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[20:27] <KayjaAthena> True
[20:27] <Rovenamarie> I've had an altar all my adult life
[20:27] <Lesley> okay I am back, just realized my battery was low so had to find also my charger
[20:27] [Owlhawk] They are ever evolving, living things.
[20:27] <Lesley> what is the topic?
[20:28] <Rovenamarie> DP until we find another one
[20:29] <KayjaAthena> Yeah, mine's just barely working for me right now. Then again, I haven't settled to ritual or meditation habits yet either.
[20:29] <Lesley> so we talking about altars?
[20:29] [Owlhawk] at the moment
[20:29] *** TrentDirenna (Mibbit@37bcff35.dhcp.trlk.ca.4e125616.com.hmsk) has joined #ADF
[20:30] <Lesley> where I live now I can not have one up in sight so I have a drawer that has it set up that when home I open and use and close when not home
[20:30] <TrentDirenna> hi everyone
[20:30] <KayjaAthena> hi trent
[20:30] <Lesley> when I open my shop either this month or next it will have one too but not sure if will be in office or out front
[20:30] <Lesley> or both
[20:32] <KayjaAthena> Mine is a storage chest. That way I can store what doesn't need to be out. Not a lot of closet/storage space in my house.
[20:32] <Rovenamarie> My office you can't have an open flame so no candles or incense
[20:33] <Rovenamarie> My only house problem is the cats
[20:33] <Rovenamarie> THey love to walk on the altar
[20:34] *** Leesa (Mibbit@361c28b6.insight.res.14056255.com.hmsk) has joined #ADF
[20:34] <Leesa> peeps
[20:34] <Thexalon> Important rule: Cats + open flames = fires that you didn't intend.
[20:34] <Leesa> indeed
[20:34] <Rovenamarie> Hello Leesa
[20:34] [Owlhawk] The wife's cats are good at leaving the altar alone. One of them sleeps in the chair infront of it and they drink from the offering bowl on the floor following ritual, but that's it. 
[20:35] <Rovenamarie> So far the only fires that have accidently happened wer both due to hubby
[20:35] [Owlhawk] Hi Leesa
[20:35] <Lesley> Leesa!  How you be?
[20:35] <Leesa> good
[20:36] <Leesa> just waitng for seamus to get home
[20:36] <Leesa> playing with the kittens
[20:36] [Owlhawk] how's the new fur baby?
[20:36] <Lesley> give hugs to yourself and him for me
[20:36] <Lesley> miss yall
[20:36] <Leesa> she's good.  she's got some kitty conjunctivitis (we think) so jim is grabbing some ointment
[20:37] <Thexalon> Leesa: Sorry for missing the Heathen vs Norse ADF distinction.
[20:37] [Owlhawk] that sounds confusing...
[20:37] <Lesley> that sounds interesting
[20:37] <Thexalon> The joys of FB discussions.
[20:37] <Lesley> lol
[20:38] <KayjaAthena> my cat doesn't mess with my altar, thankfully.
[20:38] <Leesa> leesa was having a cranky day
[20:38] <TrentDirenna> i have the same concerns with our two cats and a (theoretical) altar
[20:38] <TrentDirenna> and also a lack of space
[20:39] [Owlhawk] We're down to 3 cats now, and I've never had an issue with the cats and the altar. We trained them that they don't jump onto tables.
[20:39] <KayjaAthena> Put up a small basic altar, no candles, and see what the cats do.
[20:39] <Lesley> I miss having animals any kind around me, I can't wait till I move to my own home again and have pets again
[20:39] <KayjaAthena> my cat loves the kitchen table and still leaves my altar alone. LOL!
[20:40] <TrentDirenna> actually, maybe our two current cats would be okay
[20:40] <TrentDirenna> we used to have three but one passed away recently
[20:40] <TrentDirenna> he was the trouble maker, lol
[20:40] <Lesley> awe I am sorry to hear that
[20:41] <TrentDirenna> thanks
[20:41] <TrentDirenna> yeah we still miss him
[20:41] <TrentDirenna> died way too young really, he was only 8
[20:41] <Lesley> wow
[20:41] <TrentDirenna> he got a blood clot, which paralyzed his rear half
[20:42] <Lesley> oh poor baby
[20:43] <KayjaAthena> Aww, sorry.
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[20:44] <TrentDirenna> at least we were with him when he was put to sleep
[20:44] <TrentDirenna> it was the first time my wife had to do that with a pet
[20:44] <Rovenamarie> Hello Sara
[20:45] <SaraKarlee> hello
[20:45] <Lesley> Hello Sara
[20:45] <KayjaAthena> hi sara
[20:46] <SaraKarlee> hows everyone?
[20:46] <Lesley> Too blessed to be stressed!
[20:47] <SaraKarlee> Awesome!
[20:48] <Leesa> just chillin
[20:49] <Rovenamarie> Chatting
[20:49] <Leesa> i should be doing some work
[20:49] <Leesa> but i am here and another chat place and watching the rerun of lady gaga on snl
[20:49] <Lesley> me too but would rather chat with yall, I miss this
[20:49] <Lesley> and always forget about it
[20:50] <SaraKarlee> my brain is done with work right bow
[20:50] <SaraKarlee> now
[20:50] <TrentDirenna> heh same here
[20:50] <KayjaAthena> my brain never got started this morning. :s
[20:51] <SaraKarlee> 10 hours of crunching numbers is enough
[20:51] <Lesley> I am done with my main job, but my personal business needs things done
[20:51] <Leesa> i should be prepping my classes tomorrow
[20:51] <Leesa> but ... meh.
[20:51] <Lesley> I run a vape shop online and working on getting a store front physical by end of the month
[20:52] <Leesa> i coudl be packing for midnight flame too.  but....meh
[20:52] <Lesley> I need to be adding juices to the website tonight but being lazy
[20:52] <SaraKarlee> I wish I was packing for midnight flame
[20:52] <Lesley> me too
[20:53] <Lesley> it is one of the festivals I want to go to
[20:53] [Owlhawk] We had to back out of going to Midnight Flame as well. I was really looking forward to it.
[20:54] <SaraKarlee> I do hope to make it up there some day soon
[20:54] <Thexalon> Unfortunately, that was past my 4-hour drive maximum for attending.
[20:55] [Owlhawk] We're planning on making it next year. I figure with our big fest paid for by the wife's tax return in the spring we should be able to save up for Wellsprings, Three Rivers and Midnight Flame.
[20:55] <SaraKarlee> lol I could never get anywhere if I had that max
[20:55] [Owlhawk] Dave, if I followed that drive maximum, I would not make it to any fests at all.
[20:55] <Lesley> I am hoping to be able to make two or three next year
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[20:56] [Owlhawk] Hello
[20:56] <Lesley> same here, considering I have to fly out to most of them
[20:56] <Rovenamarie> Hello Drum
[20:56] <Drum> Hey!
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[20:56] <TrentDirenna> im hoping to go to eight winds next year
[20:56] <Lesley> Drum my lovly brother how be you?
[20:56] <SaraKarlee> hey Drum!
[20:56] <Drum> I am good and hello all!
[20:56] [Owlhawk] All the fests we go to are at about an 8 hour drive or so
[20:57] <Thexalon> We were just talking about which festivals to go to. I'm very partial to Wellspring, but that's because my grove hosts!
[20:57] <Leesa> i am hoping to get there before mindight thursday, if i don't get lost
[20:57] <Leesa> midnight
[20:57] [Owlhawk] Google maps
[20:57] <Leesa> oh i've been there before.  and yes, i have directions and gps and my own internal gps
[20:58] [Owlhawk] Thursday I'm driving someone to get a tattoo. should be amusing for me seeing her in pain.
[20:58] <Leesa> it will just be dark, so I worry i'll miss a turn
[20:58] <Drum> Dependingg on the GPS, you may end up two miles off course
[20:58] [Owlhawk] I've mostly given up on gps
[20:58] <Drum> You can always call if you need direction, Leesa
[20:58] <SaraKarlee> I have enjoyed going to Wellspring, but I also haven't been to any others. :-)
[20:58] <Leesa> yah, i saw that note.  i printed out  the link flip suggested, and yah, wrote down the number :D
[20:58] <Drum> cool
[20:58] <TrentDirenna> i would like to go to some of the other festivals, but they're just too far away...i live in California, it would really be a plane trip for me
[20:59] <Leesa> and my grove knows about when I shoudl be getting there, so if i'm not y'all can do a druid search and rescue
[20:59] <Lesley> I live in Texas so understand planning and all that
[20:59] <Drum> There is Eight Winds, Pantheacon, and Druidpalooza
[20:59] <Rovenamarie> Louisiana is a bit far for most festival and I have to have a passport to fly
[20:59] <Lesley> I don't know where I will go to next year
[20:59] <SaraKarlee> I live in FL Trent, so I get that, but you have some fun stuff around you
[21:00] <Thexalon> I will fully admit that I have all sorts of unfair advantages when it comes to making it to festivals. The 4-hour limit was to allow me to leave work at my usual time and still get there with daylight to set up camp.
[21:00] <SaraKarlee> just slightly jealous here. :-)
[21:01] [Owlhawk] Just take the day off and leave in the morning
[21:01] <Lesley> later on  in life, I see many festivals happening in a year
[21:01] <Lesley> but many goals to do first
[21:02] <TrentDirenna> i've been to pantheacon, it was fun
[21:02] <Lesley> like get me and my gal in the same city
[21:02] <TrentDirenna> i don't know what druidpalooza is though
[21:02] <SaraKarlee> it's just hardest for me right now because of toddler, or Darth Daphne as she is sometimes known
[21:02] <Leesa> i am hoping for pantheacon in two years
[21:02] <Drum> lol, Darth Daphne!
[21:03] [Owlhawk] So we can start her instruction in the Sith Arts now? Awesome!!!
[21:03] <Drum> lol
[21:04] <Lesley> lol
[21:04] <SaraKarlee> my youngest sister named her this when she herded a group of big kid into a corner and trapped them there all night
[21:04] <TrentDirenna> but is she the master, or the apprentice? :)
[21:05] <Drum> Sounds like she is on the road to mastery ;)
[21:05] <SaraKarlee> heh, well wouldn't we all like to know that! ;)
[21:05] <Lesley> lol
[21:06] <Lesley> :)
[21:06] <Leesa> oh yay, the website for my textbook is down.
[21:07] <Lesley> if yall loose me it cause America's got talent just started and I get wrapped up in it
[21:08] <Rovenamarie> But we have lots of talent right here
[21:08] <Thexalon> Sure do - you should have seen the Summerlands Bardic night.
[21:08] <SaraKarlee> wish I could have been there
[21:09] [Owlhawk] I saw one or two of Diane's videos
[21:09] <Lesley> I saw the videos and cried cause I miss it so!
[21:09] <Lesley> I love bardic nights
[21:09] [Owlhawk] That's a fest I'm not sure I'll ever make. Virginia is a tad bit too far for a weekend I think
[21:10] <Lesley> in fact I am naming open mic nights at my shop/lounge that and can't wait to see what comes from it
[21:10] <Thexalon> There's some thought going around about how we might turn that into something more than just live performances when we happen to be in the right place.
[21:11] [Owlhawk] And that's my membership renewal printed off, I'll get the money order tomorrow and mail it. I knew there was something I've been forgetting since KG....
[21:11] <Lesley> lol
[21:14] <Leesa> arg, who takes their support site down in the middle of the school week :/
[21:15] <Thexalon> People who don't place much value on the rest of their natural lifespan?
[21:15] <Lesley> omg I would not be the best person to talk to when calling for that
[21:18] [Owlhawk] site could be overloaded
[21:21] <Lesley> question yall, at my personal business I give to one nonprofit 10% of the sales, now I been keeping this local but was thinking maybe doing this for ADF at some point but was wondering how that would be, what do yall think?
[21:22] <Lesley> every three months i switch nonprofits
[21:22] <Rovenamarie> Cool idea
[21:23] [Owlhawk] If you are going to donate to charity, your own church really should be included.
[21:23] <Thexalon> If you want to keep it kinda local, donate to your Regional Druid fund.
[21:23] <Leesa> no, it's down for 'maintenance'
[21:23] [Owlhawk] that could mean it was overloaded.
[21:24] <Rovenamarie> Traveling clergy might be a good choice as well
[21:24] <Leesa> it says 'scheduled' maintenance, but yeah, coudl just be the dfault page.  although it's a book publisher site, i don't think they ge tover loaded
[21:24] [Owlhawk] now adays, you never know
[21:25] <Rovenamarie> Any site is subject to service denial attacks
[21:27] <SaraKarlee> it takes money to run the church, and we really function sure to donations, not the dues.  if only half the membership would give $5 a month we would be better off financially
[21:27] <SaraKarlee> we could be on our way to paid clergy, land, etc
[21:28] <SaraKarlee> *because of donations
[21:28] [Owlhawk] I understand, but unfortunately at this point I don't have 5 extra a month....
[21:28] <Lesley> I think what I will do is split it up when I do ADF, part regional, part as needed, and part clergy travel
[21:29] <SaraKarlee> and not everyone will, but those who do really should think about giving.  it's a chip of coffee a month
[21:29] <SaraKarlee> cup
[21:29] [Owlhawk] yup. My parents give about 50 a week to their church. I understand how the funding of a church works rather well. 
[21:31] <Lesley> hey and donations are a write off at tax time :)
[21:31] <Lesley> just saying
[21:31] [Owlhawk] actually, given that ADF does not have a CRA tax exemption as of yet, no they would not be for me.
[21:31] <SaraKarlee> yes they are that too :-)
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[21:32] <Rovenamarie> Hello fifthroot
[21:32] <fifthRoot> evening. glad I could finally make one of these haha
[21:32] <TrentDirenna> welcome
[21:32] <SaraKarlee> sorry Owlhawk :(
[21:33] <Rovenamarie> SOme of us do standard deductions
[21:33] <Lesley> welcome
[21:33] <Lesley> sorry to hear Owlhawk
[21:33] [Owlhawk] It's being worked on. The process is actually more difficult up here by what the group doing the work is finding.
[21:34] <SaraKarlee> it seems like it has been a difficult path
[21:34] <Lesley> anything good worth doing takes time and hard work
[21:34] <Thexalon> Yeah, in the US it's pretty much "Hi, we're a church." "Ok, you're tax-exempt."
[21:34] <Lesley> I am sure it will work out
[21:35] [Owlhawk] Part of the problem is that, as I recall form the meeting at Three Rivers, is that Canada actually doesn't have a Church definition to fit into, it is qualifying as a charitable organization that you have to do which is rather a different kettle of fish....
[21:38] <SaraKarlee> ok, off to bed. everyone have a nice night
[21:38] [Owlhawk] It's being worked on. A Lawyer will likely be needed at some point. Lisa and a few others are looking after it.
[21:38] [Owlhawk] good night Sara
[21:39] <Lesley> night Sara Kindreds bless
[21:39] <Drum> Night Sara!
[21:40] <Rovenamarie> Night Sara
[21:42] *** Matthew (AndChat806@b0701ded.pools.aa393787.net.hmsk) has joined #ADF
[21:43] <Matthew> Hello everyone
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[21:43] [Owlhawk] hello
[21:43] <Rovenamarie> Hello Matthew
[21:43] <Lesley> Hello Matthew
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[21:44] <Leesa> yay! maintenance over!
[21:44] [Owlhawk] lol
[21:44] <Lesley> yay!
[21:45] *** MSeneca (AndChat806@6ca5f0a3.6ca5ec83.66.87.imsk) has joined #ADF
[21:45] <Rovenamarie> Hello Seneca
[21:45] <MSeneca> Sorry about that my irc is messing up
[21:46] <Rovenamarie> It happens to us all
[21:46] *** Dale_ (guest@da0a743d.new.res.14056255.com.hmsk) has joined #ADF
[21:46] <Rovenamarie> Hello Dale
[21:46] <Dale_> Hi Rovanamarie
[21:47] <MSeneca> Any particular topic going on?
[21:48] [Owlhawk] we're bouncing around. currently between topics for the most part as the previous one is about played out. what would you like to talk about?
[21:48] <Lesley> Hello Dale
[21:48] <Lesley> and MSeneca
[21:49] <MSeneca> I was curious if anyone had read monsters and magical sticks
[21:50] [Owlhawk] haven't heard of it.
[21:50] <Lesley> nope not heard of it
[21:50] <Leesa> not herard of it
[21:50] <MSeneca> Ours on the other recommended reading list on the site
[21:51] <MSeneca> Its very interesting
[21:51] [Owlhawk] What section or course is it for?
[21:52] <MSeneca> Well. Since no one had read it anyone have a reading suggestion for trancework
[21:53] <MSeneca> its not on a course its under the training tab other reading recommendations
[21:53] <Leesa> tranceportation Diana Paxson
[21:53] [Owlhawk] Diana Paxson has Tranceportation. it's on the to be read shelf
[21:54] [Owlhawk] here
[21:54] <Leesa> read it once....can't wait to get to it. but first must finish last 1/4 question for bardic studies...grrrr....
[21:54] <Leesa> i shall smite bardic studies
[21:54] [Owlhawk] lol
[21:55] [Owlhawk] I keep saying I should start a course at some point soon
[21:55] <Dale_> What course would you start?
[21:56] <MSeneca> unfortunately I have to finish the DP but I'm really interested in some of the other course work
[21:56]  * Leesa is following michael's 9 woods
[21:56] <Leesa> except it's taking waaay more than a month/course
[21:56] [Owlhawk] Well, there's always brewing 2 or the GSP. I suspect the GSP wouldn't be all that terribly hard to do...
[21:57] <Rovenamarie> Last one out, lock up.  See y'all on the flip side.
[21:57] <Lesley> I am working on redoing my daily practice stuff
[21:57] <Dale_> What new stuff would you do in brewing 2, that you haven’t already done?
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[21:57] [Owlhawk] good night Rovena.
[21:57] <Lesley> Kindreds bless Rovena and good night
[21:57] <Lesley> love ya
[21:58] [Owlhawk] Get into how different yeasts affect the same brew for one question. don't quite remember the rest, but they looked harder then the first circle was.
[21:59] <Lesley> Well Kindreds bless all, good night and till we meet again
[21:59] <Dale_> Good night Lesley
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[22:00] <Leesa> circle 2 shoudl be harder than circle 1
[22:01] <Leesa> or at least more detailed/advanced
[22:01] <Dale_> I keep resisting the temptation to get lost in all the interesting courses as I still need to finish the DP :D
[22:01] [Owlhawk] It is. I just keep delaying getting started on something. 
[22:02] <Leesa> okay i have to give the kitten eye drops. wish me luck :)
[22:02] <Leesa> night all
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[22:09] [Owlhawk] so, what else do we want to talk about?
[22:10] <KayjaAthena> What's the topic now?
[22:10] [Owlhawk] pick one
[22:10] <KayjaAthena> Heck, i'm clueless.
[22:11] [Owlhawk] that's not a topic
[22:11] <KayjaAthena> i know. i can't think of one.
[22:11] <MSeneca> I personally like talking about trance
[22:12] <Dale_> How does trance differ from meditation?
[22:12] <MSeneca> depends on your definition of the two
[22:13] <Dale_> What is the ADF definition used for the Trance courses?  I think I saw a post on one of the email lists regarding them, but wasn’t sure what it entailed.
[22:13] [Owlhawk] Trance grows out of meditation.
[22:13] <KayjaAthena> Goodie something new for me to learn.
[22:13] <Dale_> And a topic is born :)
[22:14] [Owlhawk] It can be viewed as the next step in some ways. it's journeying, some claim on the astral plane, but journeying to the Kindreds. 
[22:14] <KayjaAthena> interesting.
[22:14] [Owlhawk] Janet Farrar and Gavin Bones discuss it in a book the title of which I can't remember
[22:14] <TrentDirenna> i tend to think of meditation as just clearing your mind, but trance more as filling it with something else
[22:14] <Dale_> So it’s like a shamantic journing or guided meditation?
[22:15] [Owlhawk] Very much so. They are a form of trance.
[22:15] <KayjaAthena> I've done a few guided meditations, with mixed results.
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[22:16] <MSeneca> some say it's magical some say its just psychological
[22:16] [Owlhawk] They take work, practice to do.
[22:17] <Dale_> I haven’t had any luck with guided meditations.
[22:17] [Owlhawk] start with basic meditation and grounding and centering. get that down first. only after that look to go further
[22:19] <KayjaAthena> I can ground and center. My biggest problem is making a habit of it. :D
[22:19] <MSeneca> I've heard it even called connecting with  collective unconscious or genetic memoy
[22:19] [Owlhawk] Keep working on that part. 
[22:20] [Owlhawk] Breathing, as well.
[22:20] [Owlhawk] It's called lots of things. the label doesn't matter, what matters is doing the work
[22:20] <KayjaAthena> I am. I have an app that is meant to help me create habits.
[22:20] <MSeneca> true just sometimes different Lego house people understand better
[22:21] [Owlhawk] hunh. an app...what a concept
[22:21] <KayjaAthena> lol
[22:21] <MSeneca> not Lego house label sorry
[22:21] <MSeneca> don't know how that happened
[22:21] <KayjaAthena> this ADHD stay at home mom needs it. :D
[22:22] <Dale_> I don’t really visualize anything well, and the few guided meditations I’ve been in have left me with nothing, whereas other seem to come out with these elaborate stories of everything they’ve seen.
[22:22] [Owlhawk] I have ADHD as well. 
[22:22] <KayjaAthena> then you well know how hard it is to  make and keep habits. LOL!
[22:22] [Owlhawk] Don't worry about how others experience things. that doesn't matter. each of us percieve in a different way. Try feeling next time
[22:23] <MSeneca> guided meditations typically work with visual people little bit better maybe you just learn differently
[22:23] [Owlhawk] I view claiming ADHD as a reason for difficulty to be a cop out, an excuse not to succeed
[22:23] <KayjaAthena> maybe try meditation music rather than guided.
[22:24] [Owlhawk] Actually I had to learn, over many years, to be able to do so. Do some visualization exercises. that may help. 
[22:24] <KayjaAthena> Very true, Owlhawk.
[22:24] [Owlhawk] I mentioned feeling in the trance because that is how I work in Trance for the most part.
[22:25] <KayjaAthena> I had to learn to deal with it the hard way. I didn't truly know I was ADHD until college. I had created some bad habits to deal with it in high school.
[22:25] <Dale_> I’ve done the more Buddist style mindfullness meditations, and need to get back into them again.
[22:25] [Owlhawk] I was diagnosed in the mid 70's
[22:25] <KayjaAthena> Those habits made college a pain.
[22:25] [Owlhawk] They are good mediations and you can move to Trance work fromthem, but I have not done so.
[22:26] <KayjaAthena> I was tested in the early 80's, but I wasn't hyperactive so they said I didn't have it. My mom didn't tell me anything till college.
[22:27] <Dale_> I find that my ADD makes it difficult to focus, but works well to browse a wide variety of topics.  Luckilly work keeps me jumping all over the place and I don’t get board.
[22:27] <KayjaAthena> Yep, same here Dale
[22:27] <KayjaAthena> But it makes it difficult to keep up with housework.
[22:28] [Owlhawk] establish a routine. that helps.
[22:28] <Dale_> When I did my undergraduate degree, access to the internet wasn’t everywhere and so that didn’t cause many problems.  My graduate degree was done online and it was very difficult to watch my lectures on the computer and not get distracted by web browsing.
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[22:30] <Maeror> Hello
[22:30] [Owlhawk] hi
[22:31] <Dale_> Hi
[22:31] <Maeror> How are?
[22:32] <KayjaAthena> LOL, Dale. I can imagine.
[22:32] <KayjaAthena> hi maeror
[22:33] <KayjaAthena> Yeah, I know, Owlhawk. Sometimes easier said than done. :)
[22:34] [Owlhawk] it takes constant effort
[22:35] <KayjaAthena> I ahd a good routine a few year ago, but hubby's job losses and 2 moves left me disorganized and a little depressed. I'm over it now and getting back in the groove.
[22:35] [Owlhawk] one step at a time
[22:37] <KayjaAthena> yep
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[22:39] <Dale_> Yes, I need to get into a routine, but the peace in quiet when the kids is so alluring that I stay up past midnight and throws off any morning schedule I’d like to have ;)
[22:39] <Dale_> when the kids….go to sleep…is so
[22:40] <KayjaAthena> I soo understand that, Dale! Mine are 12 and 9 and think they can stay up past 10 on school nights. Ugh!
[22:41] [Owlhawk] mine meow a lot and snuggle in boxes!
[22:41] <Dale_> Mine are 5 and 8, and during the summer they stayed up until between 9 and 10 pm.  Yeah, ugh!
[22:41] <KayjaAthena> LOL, Owlhawk!
[22:42] <KayjaAthena> I can't get mine to go to bed before 10, unless they are exhausted. /me rolls eyes
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[22:49] <KayjaAthena> LOL! my 9 yr old is bathing the dog.
[22:49] [Owlhawk] my condolences
[22:50] <KayjaAthena> LOL!
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[22:52] <KayjaAthena> How about we talk about divination now?
[22:52] [Owlhawk] sure. 
[22:52] [Owlhawk] too bad Leesa left, she's pretty good at divinaton
[22:53] <KayjaAthena> I've used tarot and oracle card so far. I do best with oracle cards.  I've tried runes and they're interesting.
[22:53] [Owlhawk] Drum isn't too shabby at it either.
[22:54] [Owlhawk] I use Runes for taking the Omen in ritual. I don't do much divination work beyond that. Drum is much better at it.
[22:56] <KayjaAthena> I want to try ogham. I have a bunch of branches int he back yard and plan to make ogham coins(?) with them.
[22:56] [Owlhawk] Skip Ellison published a book through ADF publishing on Ogham.
[22:57] <KayjaAthena> I'll check it out.
[22:58] [Owlhawk] His book on Solitary Druidry is excellent as well.
[22:58] <KayjaAthena> Well, it's just about 10pm here. Gotta go and get my kids to bed. Talk to you later.
[22:58] <Dale_> Good nigth Kayja
[22:59] [Owlhawk] good night
[22:59] <KayjaAthena> good night
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[23:01] <Dale_> Time to get back to packing.  Have a good evening.
[23:01] [Owlhawk] good night Dale
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