*** Opened channel log for #adf at 08/07/2014 7:52:23 PM
[19:53] [Owlhawk] 'ello Sara
[19:53] *** Adara (Mibbit@ee457069.lightspeed.snantx.3e6fd2e2.net.hmsk) has joined #adf
[19:53] <rovena> Hello Adara
[19:53] <Adara> hi
[19:54] <rovena> How are you?
[19:55] <Adara> I'm okay, how are you?
[19:55] [Owlhawk] Not good...the Daleks just stole the Earth!
[19:55] <rovena> Good.  Been one exercise bike
[19:55] <rovena> NO!  Where are they taking it?
[19:55] <SaraKBlackwelder> lol Owlhawk....I'm on that season, but in Pompeii
[19:56] <Adara> what is a dalek?
[19:56] <SaraKBlackwelder> Daphne yells WHO when I talk about putting in one :)
[19:56] [Owlhawk] Not sure yet. Doctor is on his way to the Shadow Procolomation
[19:56] <rovena> Dr Who enemy
[19:56] [Owlhawk] lol
[19:56] <Adara> oh - we don't have cable. I'm out of the loop
[19:56] <rovena> They are part human mostly machine
[19:56] <Adara> we just don't watch tv
[19:56] <rovena> They want to exterminate eerything'
[19:57] [Owlhawk] I download it
[19:57] <rovena> Owlhawk is a collector
[19:57] [Owlhawk] well....I'm not sure I'm quite that bad......
[19:57] [Owlhawk] yet.....
[19:57] [Owlhawk] I'm still missing a few episodes!
[19:58] [Owlhawk] they aren't human. they are small aliens that live inside an armoured shell
[19:58] <rovena> WHo has a more complete collection than you?
[19:59] [Owlhawk] There's missing episodes that were found recently that they haven't released yet. And I don't have the new seasons 6 and 7
[20:00] [Owlhawk] as of yet
[20:00] <rovena> It's okay.  My husband has over 1600 dvd titles.
[20:01] [Owlhawk] lol
[20:03] <rovena> he is going to add a 12 ft extension on the house so he has more room for his collction
[20:03] [Owlhawk] wow.
[20:06] <SaraKBlackwelder> did anyone participate in the Sunday chat?
[20:06] <rovena> I did
[20:06] <SaraKBlackwelder> how was it?  I was interested but already had plans
[20:07] <rovena> It was good.  Lots of ideas
[20:07] <SaraKBlackwelder> very cool
[20:07] <rovena> I needed something to plant on my trellis at my nemeton and it was suggested a nightblooming climber
[20:08] <SaraKBlackwelder> nice!  I've been toying with the idea of an outside altar, just need to collect the materials
[20:08] <rovena> We love ours.
[20:09] <SaraKBlackwelder> I honestly don't spend much time outside though, it's too hot!
[20:09] [Owlhawk] lol. I don't have much sympathy for that...
[20:09] <SaraKBlackwelder> dude.....melting is no fun
[20:09] *** jessamina (Mibbit@747c02e3.hsd1.or.5aa6454b.net.hmsk) has joined #adf
[20:09] [Owlhawk] lol
[20:09] <SaraKBlackwelder> neither is freezing, but still
[20:09] <rovena> Yes, it is right now but we love the fall and winter outside.  Not much spring here
[20:10] <rovena> Hello Jessamina
[20:10] <SaraKBlackwelder> I love the fall and winter here too....but the bugs are still gross
[20:10] <SaraKBlackwelder> and I'm always worried about snakes(a bit ridiculous, but yea)
[20:10] <jessamina> hello :)
[20:10] [Owlhawk] can't blame you there
[20:10] [Owlhawk] hello
[20:10] <jessamina> wow lag here
[20:11] <rovena> Snakes can be bad
[20:11] <SaraKBlackwelder> and most of them here are poisonous
[20:11] <SaraKBlackwelder> and aggressive
[20:12] <rovena> No fun
[20:13] <SaraKBlackwelder> I think that working outside for years also ruined me for the heat
[20:14] [Owlhawk] It would down there. I suspect you'd want a coat for our summer
[20:14] <rovena> The worse thing we have here is the mosquitos
[20:14] <SaraKBlackwelder> hmm....what are the temps?
[20:14] <SaraKBlackwelder> ugh mosquitos are bad in my yard....so it doesn't help
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[20:15] [Owlhawk] that was quick
[20:15] <rovena> Was it something I said?
[20:15] [Owlhawk] 20 to 30 is normal. down as low as 8 or 10 some nights
[20:16] <SaraKBlackwelder> ummm.....at night for sure....day I'd probably be ok
[20:16] <rovena> Celesius or Farenheit?
[20:16] [Owlhawk] celesius
[20:16] <SaraKBlackwelder> he was telling us Celesius....i hope!
[20:19] [Owlhawk] yup
[20:30] <rovena> Guess it is just us three tonight
[20:30] [Owlhawk] it might pick up later.
[20:30] <SaraKBlackwelder> maybe
[20:31] <rovena> So what do we want to talk about?
[20:32] <SaraKBlackwelder> I'm hoping to spend more time in the next few weeks working on my CTP courses.....I just need to sit down and write a lot of it
[20:32] <SaraKBlackwelder> what do you guys feel about being able to see Clergy ethics codes?
[20:33] *** JasonM (AndChat501@afb43f9a.hsd1.ma.5aa6454b.net.hmsk) has joined #adf
[20:33] <rovena> I like it.
[20:33] <JasonM> Hay all
[20:33] <rovena> Hello Jason
[20:33] <SaraKBlackwelder> hi!
[20:33] <JasonM> How is everyone tonight?
[20:33] <rovena> Fine
[20:33] <SaraKBlackwelder> good
[20:33] <SaraKBlackwelder> you?
[20:34] <JasonM> Doing well thanks
[20:34] <SaraKBlackwelder> Rovena, what I don't get is that the Vocational essays are on the website, but their ethics aren't.  I feel that the ethics would be more useful to know
[20:40] <rovena> Okay, I got confused with the Clergy COuncil Code of Ethics which is on the web site
[20:41] <JasonM> What are we talking about today?
[20:42] <rovena> The official topic is the Virtue of Courage.  We have been shootinng the breeze
[20:43] <JasonM> Ah, that seems to be the way of  chat night
[20:43] <JasonM> Always works out well
[20:44] <SaraKBlackwelder> ahh
[20:44] <SaraKBlackwelder> I didn't realize there was a topic :)
[20:44] <rovena> It was requested last week that we start doing a topic.
[20:45] <SaraKBlackwelder> gotcha
[20:45] <JasonM> Nothing wrong with that.
[20:45] <rovena> We can start on topic and let the ideas determine the course of the night
[20:47] <rovena> I had a professor that would start out on the Roman Empire and by the end of class we were on WWII
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[20:47] [Owlhawk] those are the fun ones
[20:48] <Dale_> Good evening.
[20:48] [Owlhawk] hello
[20:48] <JasonM> So how do folks define courage as a virtue  in a way that is distinct from Perseverance?
[20:48] <JasonM> Hay Dale
[20:48] <SaraKBlackwelder> courage, hmm well I think it's a good virtue.  something I find in the quiet victories
[20:48] <SaraKBlackwelder> Jason, I find that most of the virtues are very much interconnected.  They are not truly separate
[20:49] <Dale_> Courage is steping outside your comfort zone and doing something you consider dangerous (be that psychology or physically).  Perseverance is not giving up when things get tough or difficult.  I suppose in some situations, perservering may be considered dangerous and there would be cross over with courage.
[20:49] [Owlhawk] courage is action despite fear. perseverance is not giving up
[20:50] <rovena> True
[20:50] <JasonM> I would agree with both those definitions
[20:51] *** bookworm (webchat@14980234.hsd1.ca.5aa6454b.net.hmsk) has joined #adf
[20:51] <rovena> Hello bookworm
[20:51] <bookworm> hello
[20:51] [Owlhawk] the virtues mix and swirl together. they aren't simple catagories in real life
[20:51] <Dale_> I find that some (most?) virtues are self judged, it doesn’t matter if someone else finds what I did dangerous, as long as I feel so.  I’m couragous by my own standards, not by others.  I think that is, perhaps, in contrast with Wisdome…do I possess wisdom because I believe that to be the case, or because those around me have granted me that honor?
[20:52] [Owlhawk] it's something we earn by living
[20:53] <JasonM> I think wisdom is more outwardly obvious
[20:54] <Dale_> Owlhawk, are you referring to wisdom?  I know some people who have lived who haven’t accumulated it.  I agree that life experiences contribute to wisdom, there are those who don’t learn from those experieinces.
[20:55] [Owlhawk] yes I am. Not every one gains wisdom.
[20:55] <JasonM> But if you assess yourself honestly you can determine some measure of your own wisdom
[20:55] [Owlhawk] or they gain in a way you don't recognize
[20:56] <Dale_> I would say it’s also culturally specific.  The wisdom gained by a person in one culture, may not be relevant in another, and, in some cases, be detrimental.
[20:56] <bookworm> I disagree Dale_ wouldn't wisdom be wisdom regardless of what the cultural view be?
[20:57] <JasonM> I think wisdom is the ability to look at a given situation and make the correct decision based on information and experience
[20:58] <JasonM> You can be wise but still ignorant of a new set of rules. A wise person would hopefully know to seek out local info before making a decision
[20:59] <Dale_> The correct decision based on experience may be the wrong decision in a different culture.  For instance, in American business circles, being assertive is a vitrue, but not so in some Asian business circles.  One can be considered wise in business in America, yet when he travles to Asia, considred very rude.
[20:59] <JasonM> Part of being wise is knowing when you don't know enough to make a proper assessment
[21:00] <JasonM> That is a great example of not knowing new rules
[21:00] <Dale_> True, such a persons instincts and experience betrays them in a new situation.  Some times there isn’t time, or, old, but successful, habits are hard to suppress.
[21:00] <bookworm> Ahh the example helps. But then wouldn't being wise in that situation be knowing that you should check out the local culture?
[21:00] <JasonM> A fool would act without taking his lack of knowledge into account
[21:00] <Dale_> Excuse my poor spelling and grammer.  I’m typing too fast :)
[21:01] <bookworm> so wisdom would include knowing when you are ignorant in a situation?
[21:01] <JasonM> I agree bookworm
[21:01] <JasonM> Exactly!
[21:01] <rovena> Like St Francis Assisi's prayer
[21:02] <Dale_> That hypethetical person, is only foolish in that particular situation.  Is he less wise in American circles?  Or is his wisdom constrainied to a specific sphere of influence?  Few are the people who are wise in all situations, in my opinion.
[21:03] <bookworm> but that just means that we are not all-wise or all-knowing
[21:03] *** Drum (Mibbit@184d56a6.hsd1.mi.5aa6454b.net.hmsk) has joined #adf
[21:03] <rovena> Welcome Drum
[21:03] *** Mode change [+o Drum] on #adf by ChanServ
[21:03] <JasonM> He is only foolish if he acts or makes decisions without taking his ignorance into account
[21:03] <Drum> Hi!
[21:04] <Dale_> I agree, that’s why I said culturally specific, though perhaps, culturelly wasn’t the correct way to phrase it.
[21:04] <Dale_> Hi Drum.
[21:04] <Drum> Hello :)
[21:04] [Owlhawk] hello
[21:04] <JasonM> Being uninformed does not make you unwise. Not knowing you are uninformed may.
[21:05] <JasonM> Hay Drum
[21:05] <bookworm> hello Drum
[21:05] <JasonM> I think we may be splitting hairs here Dale
[21:05] <Drum> So, how is everyone?
[21:06] [Owlhawk] good
[21:06] <Drum> cool
[21:06] <Drum> What is the topic de jour?
[21:06] <JasonM> Well thank you, and yourself.
[21:06] <bookworm> good and you?
[21:06] [Owlhawk] started at Courage, currently on Wisdom.
[21:06] <Drum> Good, nice to be here with all of you
[21:06] <rovena> It took 5 sentences to move from courage into wisdom
[21:06] <SaraKBlackwelder> hi Drum
[21:06] <Drum> Ok!
[21:06] <Drum> Sara!!!
[21:06] <SaraKBlackwelder> :)
[21:07] <Drum> I like the idea of discussing the virtues, thanks everyone
[21:07] <Dale_> Sorry…I sometimes seem to distract others :D
[21:08] <SaraKBlackwelder> does anyone have additional virtues they live by, or try to live by?
[21:08] <Drum> Thrift
[21:08] <Drum> Just kidding, sorry
[21:08] <SaraKBlackwelder> lol
[21:08] <SaraKBlackwelder> I like it though Drum!
[21:08] [Owlhawk] that's a necessity......
[21:09] <JasonM> Honesty is a huge one for me
[21:09] <Drum> Honesty could be synonymous with integrity to some, Jason
[21:09] <bookworm> I like that one. Pardon my ignorance I just started reading the book, is thrift not a virtue? I feel it should be
[21:09] <Drum> Knowing how to buy might be a part of wisdom
[21:10] <JasonM> I view them as largely the same
[21:10] <SaraKBlackwelder> My favorite extra is compassion.....though I feel many, if not all of the virtues are included in that
[21:10] <rovena> Luxury might be good as it keeps others employed
[21:10] <rovena> Compassion is good one
[21:11] <SaraKBlackwelder> it helps me to relate and interact with people better (when I'm actually able to be compassionate)
[21:12] <Drum> Hmm, that is a good one
[21:12] <Drum> Perhaps it is part of hospitality - treating someone as you would like to be treated
[21:13] <bookworm> difficult one as well. It is hard to be compassionate at times
[21:13] <SaraKBlackwelder> it is part of hospitality, and wisdom, and perseverance, courage, etc....  :)
[21:13] <bookworm> Maybe more part of Honor?
[21:16] <SaraKBlackwelder> honor, how do you define that?
[21:19] <JasonM> I think oath keeping is a big part of honor. Both your personal oaths and implied group agreements.
[21:19] [Owlhawk] but that's not a definition of honor
[21:20] <JasonM> I think a big part of honor is keeping your word.
[21:21] <bookworm> honor is doing the right thing, keeping your word, being compassionate. Honoring everyone you interact with as a person deserving some respect
[21:21] <JasonM> When I think of someone who is honorable they can be counted on.
[21:22] <JasonM> Those are fantastic points as well bookworm
[21:22] <bookworm> Thank you :)
[21:22] <Dale_> I find honor and integrity are closly linked, and virtually the same.
[21:22] <rovena> I think it extends to all you inteact with not just humans
[21:23] <bookworm> agreed. I should have said "every being"
[21:23] <Dale_> Piety, I think, seems to be the non-human reflection of integrity.
[21:27] <rovena> I think of piety as the outward expression of the imward spirituality
[21:27] [Owlhawk] I like that one.
[21:28] <bookworm> piety generally seems linked to spirituality to me
[21:28] <Drum> I like that too, Rovena!
[21:30] <rovena> As long as I have been working on the DP I need to get some of it right  ;
[21:30] <rovena> ;)
[21:30] <bookworm> :)
[21:30] <Drum> You are perfecting it, Rovena!
[21:30] <SaraKBlackwelder> :)
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[21:37] <rovena> My, we got quiet
[21:37] <bookworm> we did
[21:38] <bookworm> what happened?
[21:38] <rovena> If it is my incense, I'll put it out.
[21:39] <bookworm> ok what do we all think of..... moderation?
[21:39] <bookworm> (trying here ;) )
[21:39] <rovena> It is an important one
[21:40] <bookworm> makes me think of the thrift that was mentioned earlier
[21:40] <rovena> My mother always said "All things in moderation including moderation."
[21:40] <bookworm> I like that
[21:42] <bookworm> I try to pick a mini spluge every now and then. Being thrifty all the time is exausting
[21:42] <rovena> Be thrifty ... in moderation
[21:42] <bookworm> exactually
[21:44] <Drum> :)
[21:44] [Owlhawk] I'm using my last spurge for this chat. Motherboard died in May....
[21:45] <rovena> My kindle died Thursday.  Now I have learn to use my tablet
[21:46] <bookworm> I just splurged and bought shrine stuffs and books off the reading list
[21:46] <bookworm> to be fair there was an actual NEED for candles involved
[21:46] [Owlhawk] I don't count my books as splurging since I tend to use gift certificates to buy them.
[21:47] <bookworm> good point
[21:48] <rovena> Very thrifty
[21:48] [Owlhawk] Last time was $125 in books. all on certs!
[21:49] <rovena> You have good friebds
[21:49] <bookworm> Wow! thats awesome!
[21:49] [Owlhawk] mother in law. I save the certs up for a bit before I use them
[21:49] [Owlhawk] she has no idea what to buy me, so goes with certs
[21:50] <rovena> Wisdom
[21:50] [Owlhawk] The wife told her to do it. 
[21:51] <rovena> Wisdom because she listened
[21:51] [Owlhawk] lol
[21:52] <bookworm> lol
[21:53] <rovena> I think I will depart on that high note.  Next time, y'all.
[21:53] <bookworm> take care
[21:53] [Owlhawk] good night
[21:53] <Dale_> good night
[21:54] <bookworm> I'm going to wander as well and cuddle with my kitties before they try to type for me
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[21:54] <bookworm> take care
[21:54] [Owlhawk] u as well
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[21:58] <Drum> night!
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[22:07] <SaraKBlackwelder> well, I am washing dishes, and need to clean a bit before bed.  have a good night y'all!
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[22:08] <Dale_> I go and read some news articles and come back to an empty room.
[22:09] [Owlhawk] lol. it happens
[22:09] <Dale_> The mass seastar dieoffs on the west coast were brought up dring the protogove discussion yesterday, and I figured I’d look into it a bit more.
[22:10] [Owlhawk] hadn't heard about it before
[22:11] <Dale_> Apparpently it has been going on since June 2013.  The seastars look like they are wasting away and then the arms crawl off in different directions and rip the seastar apart.
[22:13] <Dale_> Last night, one person attributed it to radiation from Fukishima, but it seems that some resent tests point towards a disease carried by some muscles which is affecting the seastars more due to the warmer waters, which make them more susceptible to disease.
[22:14] [Owlhawk] hunh. 
[22:17] <Dale_> Well time to head offline myself.  Good night.
[22:17] [Owlhawk] good night
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